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Disappointed in Elizabeth Massie

April 11, 2010

Almost a year ago, Elizabeth Massie and I had a very good back and forth which started out abut the Unitarian Universalists, then progressed into a discussion about God, the Bible, and homosexual rights. What started out on an antagonistic note (and I must shoulder part of the blame because I was angered by comments she posted about me on the Augusta Free Press) turned into a very civil talk.

In fact, here are some of the comments that went back and forth during our discussion.

Elizabeth: “I’m sure we’ll never convince each other but I appreciate the civil tone this conversation has adopted.” (June 25, 2009)

Me: And you’re right, Elizabeth, neither of us will convince the other that they are wrong. You probably realize I disagree with most of what you said in your last post, but I won’t counter any of it… I’ll let you have the last word on that. I will add, however, that I’d still like to get your perspective on John 14:6. If you decide not to comment further, let me just say it’s been a good debate. Thanks for all your input. (June 27, 2009)

Elizabeth: “Thanks for your thoughtful post.” (June 28, 2009)

Elizabeth: “That’s all from me on this, though I don’t doubt we could go on and on with our disagreements. Thanks for the exchange.” (June 28, 2009)

Me: And thanks to you as well, Elizabeth. (June 29, 2009)

I thoroughly enjoyed the debate with Elizabeth and, even though we disagreed on just about everything, I gained some real respect for her.

But as the old saying goes, “Not so fast, pardner!”

While I thought we had attained some mutual respect, Elizabeth is now posting on a lesbian blog, badmouthing me. Here’s what she’s writing on the lesbian site:

“He’s at once fascinated and grossed out by the idea of gay sex and so he’s got his own little battle raging to prove how awful it is.”

“He seems to fancy himself quite the scientist and that everything that exists in the universe must meet the challenge of his limited understanding of nature, life, and existence or else be declared wrong and unnatural.”

“He certainly ignored most of your comment (it made too much sense and he knows he had no valid point-by-point argument to counter it.)”

“I had to resist the urge to get into it with him again on his site, but it wears me out. He jumps around and avoids anything he can’t counter. I can’t imagine he’ll ever change his mind.”

“He doesn’t know how to best criticize that…it’s an inconvenient truth and so he’ll just sweep that under the rug. Why discuss something if you can’t come up with a good (if not terribly flawed) comeback? Best to ignore. Though I’m surprised he didn’t mention God. That came up in our discussion. He is all about “God didn’t create people gay! It’s against nature!” Blah blah blah. I can’t imagine living inside his mind.”

And then there’s this whopper from Elizabeth: “I tried to discuss it with him a while back and his big, final question to me was…”What has homosexuality ever done to benefit the world?”

Wow, Elizabeth. I sure expected more from you.

For anyone who’s interested (and, Elizabeth, you might be interested), here’s the link to the discussion in question. Here, in its entirety, is my final comment of that back and forth:

I understand that you believe there is no moral difference between homosexuality and heterosexuality. I disagree.

So from your perspective, “The fact that two loving, stable, compassionate men who are committed to each other form that couple should not prevent them from becoming loving parents. To disallow them to adopt based on a harmless, natural aspect of who they are, an aspect that in no way creates a greater risk of committing child abuse, is unjust and wrong.” It is your opinion that homosexuality is “a harmless, natural aspect…” It is not fact.
As for my Jim Abbott example, I don’t think I’m off quite as far as you may think. In 1993, there were approximately 280 pitchers on the major league rosters (28 teams times 10 pitchers each). That would make one-handed pitchers about .35% of all major league pitchers. If homosexuals account for 2% of the U.S. population, that would equal 5.6 one-handed pitchers. Not that different. So a one-handed pitcher is not much, much more rare than a homosexual.
I do agree with you that child abuse is a heinous crime regardless of who commits the crime. Anyone who commits such a despicible act needs to be punished to the full extent of the law.

Apparently, what Elizabeth is referring to is a totally different post that was NOT directed at her. It was a general post that referenced a discussion I’d had with an unnamed poster.

 In my post, I asked this question: “What has homosexuality brought to society?” And I answered it myself: “How about disease (anal and oral sex lead to sickness like AIDS)?”

Read the post and you’ll see I never mention Elizabeth. The post (and the question) were not directed at her.

Elizabeth, if you have a problem with me, or questions for me (you sure posted a lot of them on the other site), post them HERE so I can answer them.

5 Comments leave one →
  1. Benji permalink
    April 12, 2010 12:04 am

    Her comment are seem quite true to me

  2. organicpeas permalink*
    April 12, 2010 10:07 am

    “Her comment are seem quite true to me”???


    Obviously, you didn’t read, or understand, what was writter.

    Try again.

  3. nktrygg permalink
    April 13, 2010 1:03 am

    Oh, I am so hurt that you didn’t post a link to my site – especially when I posted a link to your site.

    When you did write what she said you wrote, why do you think it matters who it was addressed to on a publicly viewable site?

    AIDs is not only spread by sex – in fact, it’s spread by body fluid contact and one of the means of that happens to be sex.

    And it’s any sex that there’s a fluid exchange, male to female and male to male – I’ve yet to hear of any women to woman transmission. And Lesbians remain very low risk for AIDS.

    As for what homosexuality has brought to the world – mostly all the benefits of Greece that were spread by Alexander the Great and his army of lovers throughout the known world.

    ” One somehow gets the drift, when one learns that the eradication of gays 600 A.C. that started the Dark Middle Age, and it was gays like Leonardo, Michelangelo, Erasmus, Bacon & Shakespeare that put on the light again. Voltaire gave us Enlightenment, and Goethe Romanticism. Tesla gave us the electrical light and Eastman gave us film. Händel, Beethoven and Brahms & Tjaikovsky took care of the music. The founding fathers of USA, Washington & Lincoln were probably gay; the “New England Flowering” was as gay as the “Beat-generation” which gave us the youth revolt. ”

    and Gays in history

    heck, if it wasn’t for Alan Turing, WWII might have ended much later and even differently.

    we’re here, we’re queer, get used to it.

  4. organicpeas permalink*
    April 13, 2010 8:36 pm

    What a piece of trash your comment was.

    “Washington & Lincoln were probably gay”? Get real. If all you people can do is distort history with your lies, you’re doomed to failure.

  5. nktrygg permalink
    April 13, 2010 10:37 pm

    It wasn’t my comment, it was from the website I was quoting.

    The case for Washington being gay is rather probably, I am not familiar with the case for Lincoln.

    But you clearly didn’t look at the site, because the list of gay people who influenced history is very long.

    And that’s not even factoring gay people who continue to contribute to culture, science and society generally today.

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